Orders and "spinach"

Austria, the highest nobility, military (de rigueur), among themselves.
You showed too many, much: Hast Du aber viel Spinat!, in English
something like: But have you quite a lot of spinach. Among persons, who
more or less since their birth had the Golden Fleece, if military:
Military Order of Maria Theresia. It was recommended not to collect any
other orders, to hold only the highest Russian, English orders. Malta
(knights of), here younger sons or sons of poor families were placed,
to help the order financially one often became an honorary knight. In

George Lucki...

These were not peniles social nobodies. One note. This last one saw himself
as a Pole. Col. Franciszek Adamovich de Csepin after 1918 was the chief

edespalais...

on of

edespalais...

tice.

cavalry instructor of the Polish army and a knight of honour and devotion of
the Polish association. I was not aware he professed as a Knight of Justice.
I do not know what Knight of Justice in minority means.

Guy Stair Sainty...

edespalais...

May it is such, but one would rather say he had no o.

Correct is, that Silesia played a role, greater than its size. There
were three. Austrian, rather neutral, Prussian Silesia, which again was
- like Westfalia - very Catholic or Protestant. Thanks to this very,
one finds many, too many German knights of Malta. It was rather like a
very religious war, what was not to the taste of the Austrians, the
Austrian nobility. Everything not easygoing, was and is disliked. One
wille therefore also find more German than Austrian authors. In Austria
an author was rather disliked, ignored. As it is such too much was
disliked, except it came from Italy, France, England - the it was =E0 la
mode; that again disliked by the Germans, Prussians.

A knight of Justice in minority entered the Order as young as possible; the
passage money paid by his parents was higher - som entered as young as 7 or 8.

The reason this was done because commanderies of the Order - of which there
remain quite a few in Austria - were awarded on the basis of seniority, but only
members of the priory were eligible, these commanderies could only be given to
members of the priory, and not foreigners; hence there was a great advantage in
joining young. When the knight of Justice reached his majority he could then opt
to remain in this category or take the simple or preliminary vows. Then, if he
married, he simply left the class of Justice and became a knight of Honour and
Devotion. The rank of knight of Justice of minority was abolished in the 1965
constitution and code and now no-one can join before the age of 21 - the last
knight of Justice in minority is still alive, Prince Nicholas of Liechtenstein.

George Lucki...

edespalais...

ISTR

Mario Glibic...

SMOM's present ambassador to Croatia is Nikola baron Adamovich Cepinski. ISTR
that he is a Knight of the Austrian Golden Fleece.

edespalais...

Beside the Fleece everything else - in this personal case - is of the
character "spinach", therefore not to be shown!

Thanks for the explanation. Returning to Franciszek Adamovich de Csepin. My
listing has him joining as an knight of honour and devotion on 2.XII.1896 at
the age of 23. I'm guessing from what you wrote that he was enrolled at a
younger age as a knight of justice in minority. Can you provide details.
George Lucki

Guy Stair Sainty...

I am in my London office today and to-morrow (the book is in my french
house)and will try and remmeber to look this up when I get back to-morrow - then
on Thursday I go to Lourdes.

George Lucki

Austria one had to have - some exceptions - et least the rank of a
count. Concerning ladies one never spoke /used the word spinach; anyway
they had all the Stary Cross.

cj.buyers...

Alas, not to be found in the table of contents of the "Spinach" book.
Plenty on "spinach orders" instead!

Guy Stair Sainty...

Was that why several members of the Barons Gudenus became or are knights of
Malta, with Gordian Baron Gudenus becoming regent of the Austrian suc-Priory and
another a professed Knight of Justice?

George Lucki...

OK I now understand Spinach. It is quality not quantity that is important.
That is true. There is a great difference between the highest awards and the
second tier.
I like the expression - spinach. In Polish I've heard the expression
"choinka" or Christams Tree.
For some examples of dictators and other leaders wearing their orders and

edespalais...

In Vienna that was >Operetten-General<<, Operetten probably translated
as Musical, the general would be from South American

occasionally their Christmas Tree on their jacket - see:

for monaarchs see:

Guy Stair Sainty...

George Lucki...

Then - before - existed already G'schaft'lhuber, doormen, bouncers (in
Viennese: Portiere), who in those days had the lowest degrees in the
knights of Malta system. They had the Donat IInd class without beein
knights. Their dirty job was among other to publish guides, like what
is needed to become a knight of this system

edespalais...

The most extreme example might be Foxy Ferdinand, of whom we have at least 2
photos in our book wearing some of the many collars and stars he had been given
- covering almost his entire uniform jacket.

A special prize should go to whoever can identify each of Leonid Brezhnev's
and Col. Ghaddafi's medals.
Chris Buyers might take a stab at identifying those of Emperor Haile
Selassie, and Shah Reza Pahlavi.

George Lucki