Only 45% of the students were prepared for math

Los Angeles Times Mar 15, 2006 Page B9

CSU Freshmen Face Challenges; Only 45% of the students were prepared
for math and English studies at college level, report says

Guess who...

Not surprising. Even statistics of percentages of freshmen/women who
graduate won't be comparable from times past. Back then not everybody
and their pet cat went to university in order to say in their resume
that they'd been there. Not everyone back then made it through 1st
year either; it was common to lose at least 1/3 in their first year.

Perhaps some "more traditional" methods of teaching might work to give
better results? ...and perhaps the computer/hand-held calculator are
not the magic pill as stated?

toto...

Or perhaps not everyone is suited for college in the first place?

Brian VanPelt...

That might be so. However, everyone can enroll in a community
college, pay a fraction of the price, and then get the skills needed
to enroll in a traditional college.

hrubin...

They can get credits so they will be accepted. This does
not mean that they are suited for college. The colleges
have also reduced their quality, and even the graduate
schools.

This is becoming more popular. Especially for people whose high
schools have let them down (which is a continuously growing
catastrophe) and those who are in situations where education just has

Guess who...

Or they might have matured a little in the meantime, and decided to
pay attention to what they were being taught. Education has always
been a personal matter in the long run, between you and it. When you
mature [attitude, not age] it comes more readily for some reason or
another.

Sumbuny...

...and sometimes "life gets in the way" It took me about 18 years
between the time I graduated high school and the time I started
college...During that time, I got married, had children while my husband
(who was in the military) and I got to "see the world"...and after my
children were older and more settled in their own scholastic careers (middle
and high school, when they no longer needed as much supervision and
help-let's face it, elementary school tends to ask for a LOT more
volunteerism from parents ), and my husband's career in the military
started to allow me more of my own time, then I was able to look at going
back to school...

"Maturity and attitude" are not always the only factors...they can be
important ones, true, but they are not the only ones...Entering college at
28 was a little nerve-wracking--but I was not the only "over 30" student
there...and I was not the oldest by a long shot! Most of those my age
I spoke with had similar stories about why they put off going to
college....if it wasn't similar to mine, it was the "Serving my country"
one...then again, I *am* in a military community, so that would make sense

not happened (those who have had to drop out, or try to go to school
as single parents).

hrubin...

The public schools at all levels are a catastrophe, and
are no longer remediable.

I am a community college instructor and we take people who may have no
better than a 5th grade math aptitude (yep, you are reading that
correctly). They can then go through several math courses before

hrubin...

If they do not have better than that APTITUDE, there is
no hope. If they do not have the KNOWLEDGE, there is.

They can then go through several math courses before

actually taking a college level math class.

They can get up to linear algebra by the time they have finished their
community college experience (which is usually up to the sophomore
level), and then transfer to a traditional college. Most of the

hrubin...

This is so low as to be pitiful.

Most of the

community college math classes transfer anywhere - as long as they are
college level courses.

For example, every year I have people from every conceivable college
attend my classes, and the credits transfer EVERY time. This applies
even to Ivey League schools.

hrubin...

They should not transfer without an exam. This emphasis
on credits and grades suppresses knowledge, as the methods
used are typically based on not only trivia, but on what
can be easily forgotten.

Guess who...

This I'd agree with. In fact, there might be pre-requisite entrance
exams for all, aside from individual school qualifications.

hrubin...

Not aside from, but instead of. My confidence in course
grades, recommendations by teachers, etc., is very low.

It is difficult to interpret the chicken tracks even if
one knows which chicken made them.

Sumbuny...

Community colleges are one of the more popular choices in my
area...and since it is standard in Florida that *every* Florida state
institution will accept credits from other Florida state institutions for
degree seeking students, it is rather common for students to begin their
university careers in the community colleges...i.e., they will get their
first two years of education in the colleges, and then transfer to the
university system, knowing that their credits will follow them, because all
of the credits have the same numbering system across the board...

What absolutely floors me is that the high schools in our area are not
teaching the students how to do research papers....that's right, even the
"honors" English classes are not teaching their students how to do research
papers...I thought it was just my sons' high school, but no--I work with our
local Boy Scout troop, and we have a couple of Scouts from another high
school in our district, and they are not doing research papers either. When
I was with my older son at college (at *his* request ) for moral support
while he was registering for a term, I commented about this to the guidance
counselor, who was, shall I say, rather surprised. I suggested that she
talk to some of the staff at the local high schools to get a feel for the
kids that were coming their way--and she said she would...

hrubin...

Not everyone is even suited for a decent high school
program. Instead of teaching by age, teach by
knowledge and ability.

Guess who...

That simply means presenting several programs. However people may be
slotted and allotted, there will always be differences, and the public
system can not afford to tutor each individually. So, you will always
have some who don't quite fit. I'm talking at the college level about
those who should already have a fairly clear image of their
capabilities, but if you've watched American Idol, you'll have seen
the side of human nature that denies that.

hrubin...

Even at the elementary school level, there are ways around
the problem. One can get the advantage of classes, and
even a fair amount of interaction, if the classes are
arranged electronically, which is not overly costly.
A lot can also be done by individual reading, which can
start quite early.

How can the typical American college student have any idea
of his or her capabilities? The elementary and high school
curricula are designed not to give the appropriate positive
or negative feedbacks.

Guess who...

You are being purely argumentative. That is pure rubbish.

Serial Killfiler...

It's not rubbish at all. We mere high school teachers would never be
trusted to grade kids strictly upon what they know. Therefore, their
grades do not really measure their aptitudes as they should.

Virgil...

Rubin's statement is a bit ambiguous. While those curricula may not have
bee designed with that intent, the design may still have produced that
outcome. It is not clear which Rubin meant 'intent' or merely 'outcome'.

I would certainly argree with the 'outcome' inerpretation of his
comment, but not necessarily with the 'intent' interpretation.

Serial Killfiler...

Well, you said it.

hrubin...

It is not the computer/hand-held calculator which is
causing the problem, and giving it up would not make
that much difference. It is the emphasis on teaching
facts and methods which is the problem, rather than
teaching concepts and structure.

The educationists cannot understand the importance of
concepts and structure, and consider these taught by
definitions again. Grammar is highly deemphasized in
English classes in favor of "free expression", and
the emphasis is mathematics classes in computing
answers, rather than being able to ask question,
understanding that things have to be proved, and also
understanding integers and real numbers. The remedial
courses really do not do an adequate job of remediation;
almost none of the concepts get across.

Concepts and structure need to come EARLY, so the students
can know why, and not just how. This also means that the

Guess who...

Not so; certainly not necessarily so, and far too sweeping a
generalisation. You lose almost everyone if you pontificate. The
young are generally not ready for theory simply due to the fact that
they are very young, but might grasp it later when they have more
detail to put to that theory.

I know and taught both fact and theory, depending on the age and the
level. It's part and parcel of what you do. The order is important
for reasons other than you suggest. You might read up on the general
learning capabilities and capacity of different age groups[ as in
Piaget's principles].

With those clearly showing exceptional talent, they can be prepared
for competition level mathematics. Check out the olympiad
competitions and others for that level of required competence.
Others, by far the majority, need hands-on, "show me how to do it then
leave me to do it." Others in between can have it one way or another;
first practice then theory or vise versa. Some simply do not have the
ability to assimilate both theory and practice, having sufficient
problem handling simple examples one after another.

emphasis on relevance needs to go out; education is for
the distant future, not the current present.

Author(s): Cynthia H. Cho

Document URL:
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CORRECTION: SEE CORRECTION APPENDED; Remedial classes -- An article
Wednesday in California about the California State University system
described the number of students who benefited from English and math
remedial classes. The article said, "Of the freshmen who enrolled in
the fall of 2004 and needed remediation, 84% -- 22,004 out of 38,859 --
became proficient in both subjects before their second year of
college." The article should have said that 84% of the 22,004 freshmen
who took remedial classes became proficient in English and math. The
total number of freshmen is 38,859.

Less than half of the freshmen currently in the California State
University system were ready for college-level math and English courses
upon enrollment -- a figure significantly below the goal established by
the system's trustees a decade ago -- a new report said.

University officials told the Board of Trustees on Tuesday that 45% of
students who entered the Cal State system in the fall were prepared for
college-level work, a mere 2% increase from the previous year. In 1996,
the Board of Trustees said it wanted 90% of students starting college
in the fall of 2007 to be proficient in mathematics and English.

"Obviously, these figures are lower than what we would hope to be in
this particular year if we are to achieve the goals set for 2007," said
Gary Reichard, executive vice chancellor and chief academic officer.

"We don't pretend otherwise," he said.

But administrators for the 23-campus system also said they anticipated
noticeable gains over the next two years, as they began to see results
from a new assessment test for high school juniors that was first
administered last spring.

When 11th-grade students take the mandatory California Standards Tests,
they may now add a voluntary exam that includes 15 additional math
questions, 15 additional English questions and an essay that make up
the Early Assessment Program. The voluntary test helps them find out
whether they are ready for college-level courses.

Last spring, 119,000 juniors took the voluntary math exam and 185,000
students took the English exam, Cal State officials said.

Cal State faculty and high school teachers are working together to
create 12th-grade courses for students whose performance on the
voluntary tests indicate that they are not prepared for college- level
instruction.

"We have trained more than 700 teachers and are in the process of
training thousands more," said Trustee Roberta Achtenberg.

But William G. Tierney, director of the Center for Higher Education
Policy Analysis at USC, said educators can't just rely on high schools
to prepare students for higher education. He said that colleges should
assume some of the responsibility and try to serve high school students
in creative ways -- after school, on weekends and during summers.

"The community colleges, colleges and universities need to be more
involved -- not simply assessing the quality of students but working
with them to prepare them for college," Tierney said.

Of the 43,005 current freshmen, 36% needed to take remedial classes in
math, down 1% from a year ago, and 45% needed remedial English classes,
down 2%.

Since 1998, when Cal State began tracking student performance, math
proficiency has increased 18 percentage points. English proficiency has
increased only 2 percentage points, "unsatisfactory from any point of
view," Achtenberg said.

Pointing to current sophomores, Cal State officials touted the success
of their remedial instruction programs. Of the freshmen who enrolled in
the fall of 2004 and needed remediation, 84% -- 22,004 out of 38,859 --
became proficient in both subjects before their second year of college.

Of those who needed remediation, 10% did not complete their courses and
were not allowed to re-enroll.