Cloth Diaper questions

Welches...

What a pain. Where me and dh lived as students officially had that rule. I
strung up a clothes line across the balcony and never had a complaint.
Maybe you could have suggested that clothes drying indoors might make the
place damp??
Debbie

I also posted on mkp but forgot to cross post :-/

I'm going a little bonkers trying to get this figured out. If I convince dh
I'll go the prefold route with covers. I want to get some Velcro covers,
mostly for dh. Proraps seem to be a middle of the road price and get good
reviews. I will live with pins and pull-up pant style covers ;-)

Welches...

I did prefolds and velcro.

Michelle J. Haines...

I like Proraps, but I much prefer the snap style to the Velcro.

Tai...

I used towelling squares (and some brushed cotton ones) that I folded myself
with pins/stretchy fasteners and plastic pants. I tried velcro covers but

Stephanie...

Someone told me that the chemicals used by diapers services are horrid for
the environment, as bad as disposables in a landfill. I don't know if this
is true, but it may be worth looking into.

Nikki...

To be honest, I'm not really overly concerned about the environmental
affects. I'm just concerned about my pocket book at this point. If it
wasn't so skinny I'd be using disposables ;-)

hschinske...

I don't think it's true -- in fact, one advantage of diaper service
washing is that they *do* do the waste disposal properly (that is, to
the sewers), which hardly any disposable diaper users do. Yes, *some*
people dump stools in the toilet from disposable diapers, but not that
many folks, and it's nearly impossible to do with runny stools anyway.

What about hiring someone to come in and do laundry? I would think a
responsible twelve-year-old could handle that for a small sum -- you
could do the part with putting the diapers in the wash, if the kid or
his/her mother felt icky about that part, and the kid could get them in
the dryer and do the other loads of clothes. Or you could hire the kid
as a sort of mother's helper for a few hours a week, and the laundry
could just be part of it. Of course an older person could do it too, I
just figured a kid would be cheaper and get some valuable babytending
experience under your eye.

dragonlady...

I did hire a "mom's helper" when my kids were babies: a pre-teen who
came in for a few hours after school twice a week. When she turned 12,
I paid to send her to a babysitting class. When she was in college
(locally) she was still babysitting for me!

So, for me, it worked out really, really well.

Stephanie...

Mine are out of diapers. We did disposable back when we lived with city
pipes. We started with cloth, DS got a massive rash. We went back to cloth
and my DH looked at me with exhausted eyes on change number a gazillion "Why
are we doing this again?" Since I had not slept in a while, I could not

Stephanie...

The problem with disposables is not so much the stool as the gel. And I
would not think that chemicals in the sewer is any environmental blessing.

hschinske...

The only "chemicals" the diaper services use are the same ones people
use in laundry anyway (biodegradable detergents), and they're
presumably able to use water more efficiently. I can't see that there's
any greater environmental impact than you get from using reusable
clothes instead of disposable ones, or china instead of paper plates,
and I've never heard any reputable environmentalist say that you should
do those things, except perhaps in an extreme drought situation.

remember. I would not choose cloth now with a septic though.

Anyway, there is no real point to this little trip down memory lane. My
sister did cloth with her twins with no problem except the funny looks and
comments from her in-laws.

enigma...

ack! no bleach! *never* use fabric softener on diapers! (it
makes them less absorbant. don't use it on towels either)
ho often you do diapers depends on how many you start with &
how big your washer (or diaper pail) is. i did diapers twice a
week, otherwise i started getting mildew in the diaper pail

lee

there was always more leakage with them, plus they were expensive and took
longer to dry. Later I made some velcro towelling nappies that had a tongue
which folded up to give a 'disposable' effect and they were great.
(Nappy/diaper construction techniques have moved on considerably in the last
15 years!)

Questions:

Do Proraps really hold the diaper in place without pins?

enigma...

yup!

Cindy Kandolf...

I don't have any experience with that brand, but I can say that in my
experience Velcro-type diaper covers do indeed hold the diapers in
place without pinning.

One bit of advice: if you have the chance, get the covers in colors or
prints. That way, when you're in a hurry to take a load of diapers out
of the washer and toss them into the dryer, you can see the covers
easily and pull them out. Most covers, maybe all?, are not supposed
to go in the dryer.

Jeanne...

We used velcro wraps and yes, they held the diaper in place without
pins. Never used pins.

The Bummis Whisper Pant pulls up and looks higher quality but is it really
worth the extra money versus just getting the cheapest possible nylon pants
that are more similar to what our mom's used?

Rosalie B....

I can't answer the wrap question, as we never had them.

enigma...

i used the pullup kind (with side snaps) most but the Bummis
wraps are wonderful.

Cindy Kandolf...

Personally, I stayed away from the pull-up types. You need to fasten
the diaper in place somehow, and using the Velcro covers just seemed
simpler. Also, erm, well. I changed the diapers of smaller cousins
and nephews before I had kids of my own, and they all seemed to use
nylon pants, and I hated the way they felt. Stiff, crinkly, and just
slick and unpleasant to the touch. Plus, part of the point of using
cloth diapers is that they breathe, right? Maybe the nylon pants *do*
breathe, but they sure felt like they didn't...

-L....

All I can tell you is what we did and we are *very* satisfied with our
choices. I bought 4 dozen small and 4 dozen medium diapers - Chinese
Prefolds - from weebees.com. I bought the least expensive diapers they
had.

I also bought 12 small Bummis snap covers and 12 Medium Bummis snap
covers - I initially started out with 8 but ordered more. I LOVE the
Bummis snap covers! We use them with the Snappis fasteners - I think I
bought 10 or so since we tend to lose things around here. I bought a
few Diaperwraps covers at the grocery store as well - they were less
expensive, but didn't hold up as well. The Bummi's mediums fit my son
until he was about 19 months old. I temporarily went to dispos but
then ordered some large covers and am now back to cloth. I LOVE cloth!

Jeanne...

We got some wool wraps - I forget what they're called - they were
expensive but we got about a dozen of them from my SIL. I bought more
off EBay.

Tai...

Personal taste, but I reckon not. Some bubs are more inclined to get rashes
in nylon pants so it's a matter of experimenting and seeing what suits their
bottoms.

How many diapers did you find you needed for one baby per day?

Welches...

about 7/8 at newborn level, 4ish at older

Nikki...

That doesn't sound two bad. I'll want to do less laundry as they are older
because I'll be back to work. I don't want nekkid babies if I miss a day
for some reason :-)

Rosalie B....

I got diaper service for the first month or 6 weeks. It helps a LOT
if there is such a thing in your area.

For a newborn, I got 90 a week. Mostly pee, although my dd reports
that her new baby (born December 27, 2005) has had only about 4 or 5
diapers since birth that did not have some poop. This baby also
objects violently to being in a dirty diaper and escalates the volume
until you change her.

After the first couple of weeks, the number decreased.

Cindy Kandolf...

For newborns, you need to change with every feed, so 8-10 per day.
When they get older, it's a lot more variable. Some kids pee a tiny
bit relatively often and want to be changed every time. Others hold
it back until the reservoir is tip-top full, so you have wetter
diapers but fewer changes.

-L....

Initally 10-12, sometimes more. We bought 48 and washed diapers every
3-4 days. The small ones all fit in the washer, so it's really easy.

Jeanne...

We had diaper service - they estimated about 10-12 a day for newborns.
After a while, we got 70 diapers a week and then maybe 60 diapers a
week. But we never fell below that level.

Tai...

Newborns, 8-10. It depends how often they poop - some do almost every nappy.
Cloth has to be changed more often than disposables, ime.

How many wraps/covers did you find you needed for one baby per day?

Welches...

6 at newborn (tried 4 but it wasn't enough) 4 once they were on solids.

Nikki...

Oh - that seems a more reasonable number then what the sites say. I'm so
glad I asked here!

Rosalie B....

I used plastic pants, and didn't need but about 3 when they were
newborn.

enigma...

i don't remember. i had 2 dozen each newborn & infant size i
think

Rosalie B....

That's why I thought the non-pre-folded ones were better. You just
folded them to fit. You didn't have to have different sizes.

grandma Rosalie

dragonlady...

You also have the advantage of being able to fold them differently for
boys or girls, putting the extra padding where it will most likely be
needed. As a teenager when my youngest brother and sister were born, I

Michelle J. Haines...

You can do that with prefolded diapers.

Michelle
Flutist

did a LOT of diapers -- changing them, folding them, washing them,
hanging them to dry. While I DID want to use cloth on my own kids, I
wasn't interested in dealing with the washing and drying part if I could
avoid it. (What was most interesting was that my brother had extremely
sensitive skin, and his diapers had to be hung outside for the UV
treatment. He was born in January, in Superior, WI. Frankly, there's
not a lot to be said for hanging diapers on the line when it's below
zero; we'd bring them back in after a couple of hours, and stack them
in a corner until they thawed enough to hang them over the indoor line.
We didn't have a dryer.)

Rosalie B....

The sun is great for bleaching and that kind of thing. I didn't
actually believe that diapers would dry if they were frozen, but they
will. It's kind of hard on them though. I hung diapers outside in
Norfolk in the winter - not as cold as Wisconsin, but very very windy.
I didn't need to bring them inside to dry some more, but I did have a
folding drying rack which came in handy quite a few times even after I
had a dryer.

dragonlady...

Eventually, even frozen, they will dry, but it takes a long time -- a
couple of days when it's well below 0. Wind helps, but it was often
very still when it was that cold. We didn't have enough diapers to wait
that long!

This, by the way, is another advantage of using a service: as the kids
get bigger, you just have them deliver the new size. The service I used
even had a premie size, and went up to VERY large. I could also get
cloth training pants when they got old enough for that.

Rosalie B....

I only used the diaper service for the first few months when they were
using a LOT of diapers.

One other possibility that you might consider is to wait to use cloth
diapers until they are bigger and won't grow out of them as fast or
use quite so many. I also used disposables when I was going out for

Nikki...

I'm not ordering any newborn size. Just the small that go up to 15lbs. If
they are born very tiny I'll just use disposables until they fit into the
diapers. My other boys gained so fast that newborn stuff only worked for a
couple of weeks.

Rosalie B....

I never had a baby that was less than 8 lbs so newborn stuff didn't
get worn much at all. OTOH one of my grandchildren wasn't over 20 lbs
until she was older than 14 months.

grandma Rosalie

the day so I wouldn't have to bring a wet or messy diaper home with
me.

grandma Rosalie

enigma...

maybe 2 or 3. they only need changing if they get poopy (Boo
never had blowouts)

Cindy Kandolf...

In the newborn stage, again, with that mustardy breastfed poop, the
cover got hit about every other time. That would be 4-5 changes of
wrap per day. As the baby gets older, he'll poop less often, and in
time as other foods are added to his diet the stool gets solid, too.
I think I was averaging one dirty wrap per day after a while.

enigma...

i think we have a miscommunication here :)
the "prefolds" are the flat diapers, except they're thicker in
the middle than the old single layer bird's eye diapers. i
think they have 4 layers in the middle, but my kid is 5.5
years & it's been awhile ;)

Rosalie B....

We had those too, but I didn't think of them as pre-folds, and I never
folded them much but OTOH, my babies were all over 8 lbs.

The ones I was talking about were shaped - they weren't flat.
Maybe they were called 'fitted' (like a fitted sheet).

you can fold them in a bunch of different ways. i usually did
thirds & opened out the 'wings' on the backside to wrap around
to the front. i liked the different sizes because it's a PITA

Nikki...

I've had minimal expereince with cloth. As a teen I babysat for a baby that
was in cloth. This is how I was taught. We used pins and plastic pants.

i liked the different sizes because it's a PITA

to get a huge diaper on a newborn, especially if you've never

Nikki...

That is my thought too!

dealt with a baby before... i made Tom change diapers for the
first 3 days because i'd never changed a diaper in my life.
lee

Rosalie B....

grandma Rosalie

Otherwise I'd keep two in circulation, because the inside would
frequently be damp when I changed him (I had one of those kids who
would be dry one minute and completely soaked the next). So one would
be left on the changing table to dry while he was wearing the other
one. (Only one of my kids used cloth, looking back I wish both had!)

-L....

I reused the covers if they weren't too soaked with pee. Once they
were used a couple of times, they get too pee-soaked and so I'd switch
them out. So I went through 3-7 or so per day, sometimes less. I just
washed covers with his clothing.

Jeanne...

6-8. Four is just too few especially if the baby has a few explosive poops.

Tai...

4ish, depending on the poop ratio, Sometimes the outside of the velcro
covers would get to wet to use again which isn't so much of a problem with
nylon over pants.

Are diaper doubles or the extra liners necessary as a rule? Do you use them

enigma...

nope. they're handy if the kid tends to really pee a lot at
once, & at night, but not all the time

Tai...

I used flushable liners and would wash wet-only ones to reuse them and flush
poopy ones. Saved a lot of rinsing that way.

Nikki...

I've heard this too!

Nikki...

Me too :-) My aunt can come down for as much as I need her in April and
then we plan to have her down one week each month this summer. I might use
one of those weeks and send the boys to her so they get a little bit of a
vacation. They have never been gone that long but I think they would have
fun.

with each diaper?

Welches...

Didn't use them at all.

Rosalie B....

I didn't use liners because I couldn't count on the baby to poop on
schedule. They would always poop when there was no liner.

Cindy Kandolf...

I found diaper doublers to be useless, though I only tried one type
and not for long. Once the baby was sleeping through the night, I'd
put him to bed with two diapers and a fleece cover. He'd wake up with
a sopping wet diaper, but his pajamas and bed would be dry, at least.

Once he was passing solid stools, I liked the flushable liners - I put
them in every diaper because I never could predict which one would be
pooped in. But they certainly weren't necessary. For those liquidy
early stools they would be useless, but they come out so nicely in the
wash anyway.

-L....

Never bought either. Never needed them!

Jeanne...

No liners. Liners never made sense to me when I saw newborn poop. I
sewed some doublers (flannel and Malden Mills fleece) and used them at
night.

Are the Fuzzi Bunz (and similar) really that much better then the prefold

enigma...

way easier! if you want to convert a disposable user to
cloth, get the all-in-ones! get some for when you're out
shopping or travelling anyway. you'll be glad you did.

diaper and cover?

Welches...

Don't know.

Michelle J. Haines...

No, t he fancy ones cost a fortune, especially when you consider you
have to wash the cover and diaper together, which you don't always
have to do with prefolds and wraps.

Generally, I like to go with 4-8-4 diapers, 8 covers, and 4-5 dozen
for newborn.

Nikki...

Jeepers that is a lot. :-) I did a dummy order that would hopefully cover
the sizes for the first year. 3 dozen diapers each for two sizes. 16
covers (some wrap, some cheap pull up w/pins style) in both sizes and then I
included two fuzzi buns for overnight or long trip use. That was $340.
Maybe I should chuck the FB idea and order more newborn size diapers!

Do the Proraps snap covers hold the diapers in place without pins? Dh will
not fiddle with pins I don't think. I saw those snappies - maybe he'd go
for those :-)

Michelle J. Haines...

Yeah, they work exactly the same was as the velcro, except with snaps.
They hold up much better for washing.

This is for two babies.

Michelle J. Haines...

Ouch, I didn't catch that right away. I think with twins, I'd be
tempted to do half disposable and half cloth, or have the hubbie do
the laundry if he's available.

On my fifth kid, currently sleeping in my lap, most of our cloth were
worn out and we have a lot of laundry to do so we finally gave up the
cloth. However, more than one of my children has had an actual
allergy to disposables, and if that had happened again we would have
done it again.

Michelle
Flutist

Cindy Kandolf...

I'm not sure what Fuzzi Bunz are. Are they fitted, or all-in-ones? I
had some fitted diapers, thinking they could be for when other people
were changing diapers. Hah! Didn't work. They'd find the hidden
emergency disposable stash and use that. I did use them sometimes,
but I found I kept coming back to the prefolds - the fitted diapers
just seemed to take so long to dry, and they weren't that much easier
once I had the hang of prefolds. Never tried all-in-ones.

Do get good prefolds! Someone gave us some patterned ones, really
cute, but they had six layers of cloth in the middle instead of eight.
The kid peed right through them. Urg. They did make cute spit-up
rags though.

-L....

IMO, it's a huge waste of money. I was able to get all of my diapering
supplies for around $350.00 -in 2004.

Jeanne...

Never used them.

How often do you change cloth? I need to save the money but I want to

Cindy Kandolf...

As I said, a lot in the beginning, after that it depends on the
child's habits.

- Cindy Kandolf, mamma to Kenneth (12) and Robert (6)
cindy@nethelp.no ****** B�rum, Norway
Bilingual Families Web Page:

accomplish something besides nursing and changing diapers :-)

Welches...

Every 2-4 hours usually. I didn't use them overnight. It depends on how much
they wee really. I had to change #2 more than #1.

Michelle J. Haines...

10-12 a day to start.

Michelle
Flutist

Rosalie B....

You have to change cloth as often as you change disposable or the kid
will get diaper rash. I had cloth Birds Eye diapers which you fold
according to how big the baby is and not the prefolded ones. I had
about 4 dozen.

I would do a load of diapers every other day, and I hung them out to
dry on the line, but it would be quicker to use the dryer - I just
didn't have one at that time. On alternate days, I did either baby
clothes or family wash. I did not wash either the baby clothes or the
diapers in with any other family wash, and I double rinsed the diapers
using soap (I used Ivory Flakes if you can get that now) with 20 mule
team Borax. NO FABRIC SOFTENER, as that will reduce the absorbency of
the diaper.

enigma...

same as disposables, when they're wet &/or dirty.

-L....

You have to change them when they wet - it's not like a disposable that
wicks away the moisture.

Jeanne...

Whenever the baby was wet or dirty - every 2 hours?

Tai...

With twins that's all you're going to be able to do, I suspect. You might be
able to get a daily shower in there somewhere but don't count on it! :)

Thank you in advance!! I know it probably makes sense to get just a few
things before buying the whole shebang but I think I'll get the whole
shebang and hope for the best. I'll never get time to come back and order
again, and if I order all at once I think a big chunk will be paid for me as
a gift. Yay :-) I also get discounts with larger orders and free shipping.

Welches...

If it helps: I had 18 small prefolds (up to 3-6months), 18 large prefolds
and 6 shaped prefolds (which did up to about 16 months). I reckoned on

Nikki...

That does help. I was figuring on buying 3 doz of each size (but will have
two babies).

I

washing the nappies every other day. It's a very satisfying sight, nappies
drying on the line!!! :-)

Nikki...

I don't have a line. Maybe I'll get one for nice weather though. I used to
have one and used it a lot. I expect I'll be washing diapers in the dark
half the time though, lol.

And they both potty trined reasonably early, so it probably saved a few
nappy changes there too!

Nikki...

That would be a huge bonus. I used disposables with my other boys. They
were both over 3yo before they trained.

Debbie

Rosalie B....

grandma Rosalie

enigma...

where are you looking? i bought most of mine at green
OTOH, if you want my old cloth diapers, let me know! i have a
50 gallon tote full of newborn to toddler cloth diapers,
wraps, all-in-ones, wipes & carry bags (waterproof nylon for
changes on the go)
oh, & if you go with prefolds, get the Snappi fasteners. much
better/faster/easier than pins, at least until they get
mobile.

Nikki...

No kidding!!?! That would be great. How much do you want for them? My
reply email address should work just fine. :-D

lee

-L....

That's what I did - I just took a chance on Chinese prefolds, Bummis

We recently ordered Large covers and are still using cloth. I will
NEVER regret my decision to do so! Another great benefit is you can
resell them (diapers and wraps) on eBay for almost what you pay for
them!

One thing I will mention is to follow the washing instructions supplied
with your diapers. Do not ever use bleach as it will ruin your diapers
*very* quickly. We pre-swished poopy diapers in the toilet, wrung them
and stuck them in a bucket, or into the Diaper Champ with the peed
diapers (which went directly into the Champ.) I did 2 washes in Arm &
Hammer Free detergent, the second wash being HOT with A&H washing soda
added. I double rinsed and added vinegar to the final rinse. My dipes
came out clean and fresh smelling every load. :)

Good luck - I don't think you will regret your choice.

Tai...

Think about using disposables at night, especially if you mainly have wet
nappies then. They will last through the night in them, usually.

As for washing them, I dumped them all into a bucket of pre-soaker, ran them
through a cold rinse first and then put them through one normal wash cycle
using the family's laundry powder. I'm pretty sure I used a cold cycle
unless there were a lot of poopy nappies in the bucket. Then I line-dried or
used a dryer depending on the weather. I liked to put a load through every
two days at least.