opinion on toddler

Is it normal for a 2.5 year old to scream and screech constantly? Should a

Jeanne...

For some, yes, if the circumstances are ideal.

parent simply ignore the behaviour because it is a normal phase that will
stop over time? Do parents with 2.5 year old never get to eat one single
meal in peace because of the excessively loud screams and screeches coming
form their children?

L....

Mine doesn't. He will occassional squeal or screech in joy, or just to
make noise, but it lasts less than a couple minutes. I am teaching him
to: "Shhhh! That hurts Momma's ears!"

Penny Gaines...

It's been a while since I've had a 2.5yo, and it does sound like he is
a bit wild....

BUT...

when you are staying away with a 2.5yo, they have an unfamiliar routine,
with an unfamiliar bed, and unfamiliar food, and there parents may be
feeling tense about any bad behaviour, which upsets the child more, and
causes more shrieking and screaming.

I just had an arguement with my friend because after three days of them

bizby40...

Yes, you guys have a good point. My DD10 still does this. Oh, she
doesn't scream of course, but whether we're at friends, or they're
over here, if I'm trying to talk to another adult, she will constantly
interrupt, literally put her face in my face to ask questions and so
on. I've been told that she sees me as the prize, and feels in
competition with whoever is around for my attention.

visiting, I finally lost it and asked her how on Earth she can live with
this behaviour day in day out. Her 2.5 year old, IMO, is out of control. He
is constantly screaming and screeching for no reason. He also pushes other
kids around, yells NO in their face at everything they do, and steals toys
constantly without any intervention or consequences, or anything for that
matter. They also have a 12 month old who has started to learn the loud part

L....

Parents aren't parenting, obviously. I'll bet the kid goes to
daycare...

of the behaviour. At dinner, we couldn't even get one word in between the
noise! It was ridiculous... like a zoo! I have a 14 month old, who cried
almost the whole time they were here because of the excessive noise, and she
claims that it'll be the same for me soon enough and that I should read up
on toddler behaviour. I believe a child at the age of 2.5 should be able to

Jeanne...

Maybe. Maybe not. It sounds like you two have different expectations
and home environments.

sit at a dinner table and demonstrate an acceptable noise level. I told her

Jeanne...

I hate to say this but - wait until you've going through this before
judging or even having expectations. All kids are different. Some will
sit quietly and amuse themselves at 2.5; others will fidget and be
restless and yes, noisy.

L....

Agreed - within reason. They will occassional have an outburst.
That's why we don't dine out.

that I'd use time-outs and discuss the problem and solutions with a 2.5 year
old. She claimed that the child would be in time-out constantly and that it
wouldn't work because this is a normal phase.

Jeanne...

Discuss problem and solutions with a 2.5 year old??? What??

Okay, again it depends on the child. I could discuss "problems and
solutions" with my daughter when she was 2.5, but she was incredibly
articulate and had an amazing vocabulary. But "discussing" wouldn't
even occur to me with my son who's just 3 years old. He's totally
different and "discussing the problem and solution" isn't going to happen.

L....

Not normal at my house.

It's not that I think toddler's need to be quiet all the time, but they need
to learn when noisy is acceptable and when quiet is required.

What's your opinion?

Jeanne...

That you don't want to invite this family back for a 3 day visit. But
please don't disparage your friend's parenting skills or method based on
her son's behavior. He was out of *his* routine and environment, so
maybe there was a reason for his screaming and screeching. Also, if
there is anything I learned, if your child hasn't reached that age,
don't give advice to the parent.

user...

Not to contradict the comments by the others, but.... ;-)

Some kids are noisier than others. You can't do much about that,
in lots of cases. It usually passes in time.

However - it's *incredibly* rude of the parent to let the kids
continue sitting at the table if they're making a ruckus.
( With the obvious leniancy in cases of things like a birthday
party, etc. ) When we've visited other people, if our kids acted
like that, they were out of the room fast enough to make heads spin.
And when we returned to the table, the hosts would have our sincere,
abject apologies. And if the tot(s) started yelling again, well,
it wouldn't be the first time I've missed dinner because of the kids.

As others noted - timeouts work on some 2.5 year olds, and not
on others. With some kids, ignoring outbursts will, in fact,
minimize or eliminate them. But three days is way, way too

Penny Gaines...

I think this is about the most telling thing you've said.

However, it also means that the mom probably needs more slack.

She has a difficult-to-control toddler and a baby. She has a
husband who is not there to provide support for several nights
at a time - and just how involved with discipling is he when he
is there?

long for that to go on, under any circumstances.

So I'd say to cut the kid some slack - you may end up
with a screaming toddler too. But the parents? There's
absolutely no excuse for their behavior at all, if they
did in fact not remove the kids and make amends afterwards.
That's rude beyond belief.

Ericka Kammerer...

That I would definitely agree with. You can't
always pick what sort of issues your kids throw at you,
but you can make some appropriate decisions about what
to inflict on others. It sounds like the OP and her
friend are close enough that perhaps there was an
expectation that they were close enough to deal with
this. Perhaps the friend is rather starving for some
socialization, as I imagine her opportunities are
limited given the described behavior! But even
family shouldn't be subjected to that sort of behavior
for that long :-/

Best wishes,
Ericka

- Rich

L....

I totally agree. But timeouts don't really work until age 3 or so. I
make my guy sit still with me and settle down.

dragonlady...

My opinion is that being this judgemental about someone else's children
and parenting will not serve you well in the long run. You are not with
them all the time, so you have no way of knowing what else might (or
might not) be going on. They may have kids who are by nature louder
than yours, they may be dealing with other (possibly even undiagnosed)
issues, they may be working from an entirely different parenting model,
or they may, in fact, be lousy parents -- but you can't really tell that
from one three day visit.

If you are looking for advice, my advice would be to not plan on
spending this much time with a family whose children bother you this
much.

But my advice would also be to model the sort of parenting you think is
appropriate, and to not criticize other people's parenting or other
people's children. Advice should only be offered when it is requested.
Unless the parenting is at a level that you believe needs to be reported
to appropriate authorities, it works far better to stay out of it.

Nikki...

Hmm. He sounds like a handful. It could be the environment. My kids are
much more difficult when people are around then when I'm alone with them.
It could be he is an extra difficult child. It might be that her parenting
is a little lax, who knows. You've said she is a woman with a high strung
toddler, a baby, and a husband that is gone for a week at a time. She might
run out of energy to fight every battle. The other thing I haven't seen
mentioned is the 2yo might have an actual problem. Some kids have
neurological things going on that results in wild behavior and they are
rather impervious to typical parenting techniques

2.5yo is a hard age. Some kids are mellow and others aren't and that is
just the way it is. Try to cut her some slack and help her if you can. If
he steals a toy from your kid get down on the floor and show him how to
trade or share or whatever. If he pushes get down there and show him a
better way. If it works - great. You've modeled a technique she can use
and given her a break at the same time.

Daniel J. Matz...

I agree with you. My 2.5 year old only screams when he is upset or does
not get his way, and has learned that screaming will not get him his
way. He sits quietly at the dinner table and knows that he cannot leave
until everyone has finished eating. If he is done before us he will
look at one of his books or something until we are all done.

dragonlady...

Just curious -- what is the point of requiring him to sit at the table
if he is not interacting with other folks there? I wanted my kids at
the table, but it was to be part of the conversation -- I would not have
allowed books there, any more than I'd have brought the newspaper to the
dinner table. (Breakfast is another matter!) As long as he is looking
at books, why not let him leave the dinner table and look at books
elsewhere?

(Not a criticism, please -- I'm just curious as to the intent behind
requiring a child to stay at the table but allowing a "solo" activity
while he's there. In my mind, sitting to dinner together is about
building the family relationships, and reading a book doesn't do that.
So I'm curious about what sitting at the table until everyone is done is
about.)

Daniel J. Matz...

Like you, I want him there to be part of the conversation, build family
relationships, etc., but his communication skills are still somewhat
limited. I want him to get used to the idea of staying there even when
he is done eating (in a restaurant, for example, leaving the table is
not an option). Without something to do, such as the book or a toy, he
gets bored and whiny. The book can also get him involved in
conversation, he will point at things in his book and ask "What's
that?", so it becomes a learning situation as well.

Ericka Kammerer...

That you're probably not in a position to be
judging other people's parenting. Even with a three day
visit, you still really don't know much about their
children or their parenting. No, not all toddlers screech
constantly, but you have no way of knowing for sure if
there is something about her child that causes that or
if it's her parenting. In all likelihood, you probably
won't end up in the same situation, but you never know
for sure. I find it prudent to avoid both being smug
about how my kids are going to be much better behaved
in the future and also conversations where other folks
tell me to just wait until I'm in their shoes.
All you know right now is that you probably don't
want to invite them over for another extended visit in
your home. Beyond that, it's not really your business,
and you'll really be happy not to have to eat your words
someday if you ever find yourself in a similar position
or if she finds out that her child has some kind of
issue that yours are blessed not to have.

Best wishes,
Ericka