invisible fencing

I'm looking for some info on invisible fencing and aggression. My

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

HOWE many CASE HISTORIES of shock devices of ANY kind
makin dogs aggressive and attacking folks and gettin
DEAD over it would you LIKE, Floyd?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

Some run through it. Others get shocked and become
too scared to go out in the yard anymore.

Just heard of a guy that has to rehome his dog,
because the dog got caught right in the path of
the shock and will now not go near his person,
won't go outside.

Just hides under a desk in the house.

From: Mark Shaw (m...@bangnetcom.com)
Subject: Re: Fido-Shock
Date: 2002-04-10 14:12:18 PST

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

If you're talking about the pet-grade hotwire system,
I have one. It's to keep boarded dogs out of my flowers.

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

I take it you're considering running the wire across the top
of the fence? I don't think I'd recommend that, although it
may be worth a try. Watch closely -- the one case where I saw
a hotwire used in this fashion caused the dog undue stress and
frustration, and he tried even harder to get over the fence.
So be prepared to take it down right away.

That was a Dane, though. With a Saint things might be
different.

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

janet knows ALL abHOWET that, don't you, janet, you pathetic
miserable stinkin lyin dog murderin active acute chronic long
term incurable mental case and professional dog murderin fraud.

Janet B...

It's too common.

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

Yeah. Like that little DEAD DOG YOU MURDERED in "interested
in hearing" where you "overlooked" two shock CON-TRAINMENT
systems that made the little dog FEARFUL and AGGRESSIVE to
visitors.

You told his owners to lock IT in a box and jerk an choke an spray
IT in the face with aversives when IT grHOWELED at guests. THEN
you told them IT would need MONTHS of "OBEDIENCE TRAINING
LESSONS" with you and IT PROBABLY WOULDN'T WORK so
they might as well MURDER their dog iif JERKIN CHOKIN SPRAYIN
IT in the face with aversives an SHOCKIN IT didn't work:

LIKE THIS:

"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss

"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution
Will Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER"
lynn.

lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to
it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.-
if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.

"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.

"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary,
just to be able to handle the dogs. For example,
we need to crate train a dog immediately because
they are usually in need of medical care and they
are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety
necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.

"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.

"So what? Whoever said that it's right to
always not confront? We sure can try, but
a dog who knows a command and growls when
given it is certainly being confrontational".
You can't simply walk away and pretend it
didn't happen or leave it for later work in
every situation." Lynn K.

--------------------

clicked their heels and said:

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

BWEEEEEAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

You mean YOU GOT NO TRAININ METHOD, eh janet?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

On accHOWENT of YOU GOT NO TRAININ METHOD, janet.

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

They're AFRAID on accHOWENT of they're gettin SHOCKED, janet,
JUST LIKE that little DEAD DOG YOU MURDERED in "interested in
hearing". REMEMBER janet?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

INDEED?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

Seems Floyd's CONSCIENCE is botherin him.

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

That's kindly of you, janet. You got any TRAININ ADVICE?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

You mean YOU AIN'T GOT NO TRAININ ADVICE, janet?

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

Oh? You mean LIKE THIS, janet?:

From: J1Boss
Date: Wed, Aug 22 2001 3:57 pm
Email: j1b...@aol.com (J1Boss)

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

Diana - with all due respect, I don't think building a kennel run is
the answer
for this poster. I'm not a huge fan of IF's, BUT, they work extremely
well for
some people and dogs and when the dog is properly trained to it (and
the OP
indicated that the dog IS), the dog never even tries to cross the line,
so no
nasty surpises are involved. This tool, like any other CAN be poorly
used, but
that doesn't seem so in this case, and the freedom it allows the owner
is
pretty great. Beagles need exercise, but are notorious for following
their
nose and not being all that responsive to coming when called. If the
IF allows
the owner to play with the dog and exercise him, why confine the dog to
a small
area? Also, the OP didn't mention it, but it could be that a fence or
fenced
run are prohibited where he lives.

Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"

The_Insanely_Freakin_Simply_Amazing_Grand_Puppy_Wizard_...

yes - screaming banshees are told to shut up! And I
always have to remind spouses that they may NOT do the
"honey - you're supposed to be doing it like THIS"......

neighbor had issues with one of his dogs (border collie mix) running
around the neighborhood. The dog used to be on a farm with pletty of
running room but now in suburbia he's limited to a half acre and they
got an invisible fence to keep the dog in. They also have another dog
(shepard mix) that also gets to wear the collar now even though she
didn't run off. Both dogs are very friendly and good with kids however
about 6 months after getting the invisible fence, both dogs have been
getting more and more aggressive. If anyone is walking the neighborhood
or going by the house the shepard mix will charge the line, bark like
crazy, and kick like a charging bull. Both my neighbor and myself have
tried to discourage such behavior but we haven't had much luck. I worry

Janet B...

What have you done? The dogs shouldn't be out there unsupervised -
period. It's not uncommon for dogs with IFs to feel that everything
they can see is THEIR territory, and act accordingly. It's not
considered legal fencing in many places. Leaving dogs out unattended
with an IF (I wouldn't do it with a real fence either) is a recipe for
disaster.

diddy...

It's not his dogs, nor his fence

that at some point someone will get hurt and the dog will have to be
put down. She is still very friendly and good with my kids but anyone

Janet B...

All it takes is one kid over the line or the dog deciding that the
correction is worth it.

Paula...

Exactly.

There are far too many dogs picked up by animal control with their
invisible collars still on to assume that this won't end in disaster.
It is impossible to ensure that one of the dogs won't decide to just
run the fence line, take the shock and then be free to fight it out,
At the same time, dogs get more worked up over things they can see and
assume are on their property. The most laid back dog we have still
goes off when he sees the neighbor's cat in his backyard through the
glass slider. He hates dogs being in his front yard, too, which he
can see through a front window. Since he can see the street from that
window, the dogs are not supposed to be on the public street in front
of our house either. They don't like the chihuahua that fence fights
by barking from the other side of a wooden fence. I would be that
eventually one of my dogs would take a chance on running through an IF
to get to the little brat if they were left out there every day
watching him flipping them the dewclaw in full view.

Invisible fencing is a good alternative to physical fencing, when that
isn't allowed. That said, leaving dogs in yards on their own,
particularly with IFs, is a very, very bad idea. If your neighbor
can't come to grips with that, I hope they are willing to have dead
dogs and have a good insurance policy.

else - even people that she has been introduced to - face her wrath
when approaching the property. After reading some related posts it
seems like some like to flame those who use invisible fencing. I don't
own it, I don't condone it, I don't like it. The use of such isn't
going to stop so take your flame elswhere. I'm just looking for ways to
change the behavior. TIA

lgohring...

Are they aggressive because the fence is invisable? Wouldn't they act
like that with a regular fence? Aren't they becoming overly protective
of their space? Don't most dogs who are left in the yard day in and day
out become very protective of it? Doesn't the yard become their whole
world?

These are actually questions. I not stating anything.