More on my new Dell

I posted some time back that Dell were sending me a new monitor because the
first one was too bright. It took some time to arrive but finally got here

pmj...

last Friday. The Dell chap kept phoning during this time to check if I'd
got it.

Set up the new monitor and was surprised that it was still bright but
thought not quite as bright as the first one. The Dell chap rang and I said
I thought I could live with it with all brightness settings on zero.
Mistake - it got worse.

Sat here last night - eyes aching from the brightness and decided I could
no longer continue using the monitor - I'd lose my eyesight. searched the web for a bit
and found others with the same problem with this monitor. Others didn't
have the problem.

Stephen Baker...

I received my new machine yesterday, with the 1907 panel a bit bright
but with a combination of

Graphics card settings

Gamma 0.5
Brightness -76
Contrast 113

Monitor settings

Brightness 39

Troy's Human...

Thanks Stephen - I've changed to your settings as a test. Sorry that makes
it worse :-(

Reducing the Gamma does help to reduce the brightness but it changes
colours too much.

Charlie Drake...

Having done a bit of reading maybe you should ask them to replace your
panel with a 1905 it seems they have moved to a 6 bit panel in the 1907
to get better response times (8ms) for game players and video (they are
also cheaper) the Older 1905 is a Samsung 8 Bit panel with a poorer
response time (20ms) but better colour rendition more suited to office
and graphic applications.

Troy's Human...

It's the 1905 that I've got. Are you saying I'd be better off with the
1907?

Charlie Drake...

Reading on the Dell support forums it seems the 1907 panel is the one
with the brightness issues, and that with 1905 is OK. When you got the
panel was there a driver disc with it? Have you checked on the Dell
support site to see if there is a newer driver for the panel? The latest
showing on there site is dated 10/21/05.

Troy's Human...

Thanks for you help Charlie (see my other reply).

I find it just right.

Phoned Dell again this morning. The chap was *very* helpful - went through
a few things. I asked if he'd come across this problem with this monitor

pmj...

Yep.
Handling all those "First Boot" things properly & *carefully*
is often *crucial* to the proper subsequent Running of the PC.

Far too many people just Click [OK] & [Next>>>] at all of the Prompts,
without properly thinking about what they are asking.

pmj...

Yep, we can gues...

pmj...

have you not got any other Monitor you can use with it?

It does rather seem as if it's prolly a *Monitor* prob, rather than
a Software/Driver/Operating System or Settings prob.

pmj...

Tell them that you don't want it & get a refund?.
Cos (under the sale of goods Act) it's not suitable for the purpose
for which it was Sold.

Or (if it's still within 7 *Working* Days of Delivery (that's your
*Receipt* of it, not Despatch), write to them & say you are returning
it under the "Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations
2000 - Regulation 10 (3)"

Then, when you have the Refund, you could go to a Shop (Retailer)
or Store or something & look at the various Monitors/PCs & buy one
from there? - After having picked one that you are happy with.

before and he said yes - he'd seen one. He then said we'd have to return

Wally...

This any help ???

pmj...

LOL!
:-)

Or maybe...
http://oakley.com/

Troy's Human...

Thanks Wally. The bunkers that way :-)

the computer to the state it was in when first used - I presume a re-format
or something - dunno. I'm backing up stuff and he's phoning tomorrow to
talk me through the process.

Another possible problem - the van driver who delivered the second monitor
refused to take back the first one. He said the company used by Dell had
contracted out this delivery to him and he wasn't allowed to take returned
goods. I now have 2 monitors and await Dell again .... :-)

datasmog...

heh. If you recall a previous post of mine regarding a neighbour who
ended up with two Dell PC's because they never collected to faulty one.
You may have won a second monitor.
If you can overcome the brightness problem it'll give you an imressive
amount of desktop realestate. Assuming your graphics card will support
two monitors. Otherwise, buy a second card :-)

In spite of all this I'm full of praise for Dell - I cannot fault their
after sales service.

Faolan...

It's just a shame they don't use AMD processors ;)

Seriously have you thought about using a anti-glare screen to reduce the
brightness? I know it's a Dell issue but it's a thought...

Troy's Human...

As a last resort I suppose I might have to :-(

But I'm *sure* this problem is not just me being fussy. I've been using
computer monitors for 25+ years and never had this problem before. This
monitor has a big brightness problem.

Had a friend check it out a couple of times - she's an amateur photographer
- belongs to local photographic clubs etc. She is over the moon about the
quality of the monitor for displaying photographic images but says she just
could not work with the brightness for doing other things. Shame - she'd
buy one tomorrow if it wasn't for the brightness problem.

Troy's Human...

To follow up on myself. Just spoken to friend's husband - he (he
understands computers) says she's been put off buying any kind of TFT
monitor after seeing the brightness of mine :-(

I took a photo of my desk + monitor (almost blank white screen) earlier.
Looks a lot worse than it really is but I think you might get the picture

Rabbit...

I have white backgrounds on OE and IE ( where it isn't specified as white in
the HTML) set as a light greyish 'cos I always, even in CRT days, found
white to be bright. When I got the TFT I set it to a slightly darker greyish
'cos I too found the white much too bright.

:-

Aries...

goodness me that does look bright

Troy's Human...

It is :-(

of course you have run the Adobe Gamma calibration for your monitor from
control panel ?

Troy's Human...

Never tried it but went there and had a play. Anything I did made the
brightness more intense :-(

pmj...

I would suggest turnin gthat Adobe Gamma Loader thing *off*.
Disable it from Running at BootUp

It very often causes more probs than it Helps, for most people.
It's really only designed for when you're doin ga lot of accurate
Color Matching type stuff, between Paper, Screen & Printers.

Look for an Option in its Setting to turn it off (or Disable it
using MSConfig) - or just take the Shirtcut to it out of your StartUp
Folder, if there's one in there.

I really think I've set the brightness level to the lowest possible. Even
sat the wife in front of the screen tonight and asked her if she could work
with a screen of this brightness. "No way" was her answer.

pmj...

Is this using the DVI (Digital Video Interface)?
Or using the normal DSub Connector?

Troy's Human...

I'm using DVI

pmj...

& do you have the same prob with it, when using the other
(DSub?) Analogue Input?

& can you have a look in:

Control Panel>Display
Or RightClick Click Desktop>Properties...

Switch to the "Settings" Tab, Click [Advanced...] & then Switch to
the "Color Management" Tab in the Dialog Box that Opens up.

What's showing in there?

Current Monitor:

Troy's Human...

Plug and Play monitor.

Charlie Drake...

Just read this after send a reply to your last post, it seems from the
above that you haven't got the 1905 driver loaded.

Troy's Human...

That's right - I don't have it loaded. I told the Dell chap that and he was
unable to do it as the driver was not on any of the supplied CDs. I did
actually go to the Dell site a couple of weeks ago, downloaded it and then
installed it (told the Dell chap that as well) - It didn't make any
difference. I've done the same thing now (got the URL from your other post
- thanks). Still doesn't make any difference :-(

Charlie Drake...

Has it installed though? Could you repeat pmj's instructions and check
if it comes back showing the 1905.

Troy's Human...

It's installed OK -

Now showing "Dell 1905FP (Digital)"

pmj...

Ah...
Like Charlie Drake spotted, that means that windoze is using its
own standard (Generic) Drivers for the Monitor
I wouldn't *expect* it to actually make much difference, but it
*might* be worth while trying it with any specific Drivers for the
Monitor?

Default Monitor Profile:

Troy's Human...

pmj...

Good!
You shouldn't have to have any special ICC Color Profile for it.
But see below...

& what (if anything) is Listed in the List below there, Labelled:
Color Profiles currently Associated with this Device:

Troy's Human...

Nothing listed.

pmj...

OK.

It *might* be worth while, seeing if you can find (or get from
somewhere) an ICC (International Color Consortium) Color Profile
for the Monitor?

They should be available either from Dell, or from the Monitor
Manufacturer.

Usually, when a Monitor-specific (or Printer-specific) Driver
is Installed, it puts in some ICC Color Profile(s) for it (if there
are any), then you can choose one of them, if you want.

Post back with what you have at the mo in there.

Troy's Human...

pmj - thanks for your help with this. I'm unable ATM to carry out the other
test - see my other post about the state of my PC :-(

pmj...

OK, but I'd like to see the results of a ScreenDump of a Browser
Window on your (windoze) Desktop showing that particular "test" Image.

Can you not just do a ScreenGrab & Paste it into something like
M$ Paint & then Save it (as a .JPG) from there?

No real need to Install anything - but IrfanView doesn't involve
anything much in the way of Installation.

Then (when we know what you have in there) we can come up with some
more suggestions & things to try.

Flyi�g �u� 2��6 +...

My GNR 17" TFT looks that bright at night with no other illumination in the
room, but I have a 100 W lamp on in my small computer room so it's fine.
Added to that I have my )E display background set at a pale pastel shade of
green.

pmj...

Have you tried it with a different Monitor?
Say an ordinary CRT one?
Or another type of (not just another one of the same Model of) LCD one?

You need to suss out if the prob is the Monitor itself, or the
Output from the Graphics Card.

Can you try something for me?

Open up this URL...

It's just a 13 KB .PNG (Portable Network Graphics) Picture.
It's actually 1800 x 1500 Pixels, so it won't fit on any normal
LCD Screen when viewed at full size.

It's one of the "test" Picture/Color Files that I have made,
over the Years & that one contains 30 x 255x255 Pixel Squares
of Fades/Gradients from every Primary Color, to every other
Primary Color - that's Red, Green, Blue, Cyan, Magenta & Yellow,
along with White, Black & Grey, all on a *Black* (0,0,0 RGB)
Background, so it's useful for testing the Full Color (&
Brightness/Contrast) Range of things like Monitors & Printers.

Open it up *in your Browser* - & not in a Graphics Program
or anything.

Set the Browser Window to *not* FullScreen or Maximised - make it
so there's a bit (about an Inch or so?) of Desktop (& the Taskbar)
showing all round it.

& make sure that the Setting in the Options is Set to Automatically
Zoom/ReSize Images, if you can, so it all fits in the Window, showing
all the Squares.
Internet Explorer has that Option (on the Advanced Tab of the
Internet Options, in the "MultiMedia" Section)

Then, can you take a ScreenGrab of it? - The *whole* Screen,
not just the Browser Window... (but see [*1] below)

Use the PrintScreen Key (without Pressing [ALT] at the same time,
so as to get a Screen Grab of the *whole* Screen, including the
Browser Window, with the Pic in it, the surrounding Window "Furniture"
& the Desktop (with a few Icons Visible, preferably & also the TaskBar.

Then, Save the ScreenGrab & Post it up on some WebSpace some where
& then Post up the URL to it..

If you've got something like IrfanView, or PaintShop Pro or PhotoShop
or similar, you should be able to Save it as a .PNG File, which will
Compress it a fair bit, without altering the Colours.
If you can't Save it as a .PNG, try saving it as a JPG, but Set the
Compression/Quality to about 50.
If you *have* to, you could Save it as a .GIF, but that will chop
the number of actual Colors in the resultant File down to a maximum
of only 256, so the Gradients won't be very smooth.

What we are looking for, is to see whether the Graphics Card itself
is Outputting the right Colors & range of Levels.

& also if you look at the 3 Squares in the Bottom Right of it, on
your Monitor, you should be able to see if the Black is really Black.

There is a Square (the left one of those 3) with a smooth Gradient
from Bright White (255, 255, 255 RGB) to Mid Grey (128, 128, 128 RGB),
then one with a smooth Gradient from that same Mid Grey to pure Black
(0, 0, 0 RGB) & then one with a smooth Gradient from Bright White
to pure Black.

All of the Squares also have a 1 Pixel wide Border round them, with
a Gradient of the Inverse (Negative) Color, so you can compare the
Color & Brightness/Darkness Levels & make sure that the full Range
is visible.

But if you Post up the ScreenDump, we can then look at it & see what's
being sent (from the Graphics Card) to the Screen Display Drivers.
Thus eliminating the Cable & the Monitor from what we see.

It will be interesting to see if the Full Range, from Black to White,
is there, or if the Screen is being sent an overly Bright Image.

I've got another few of those sort of "test" Images, that I've made,
if you want to try some others as well.
:-)

[*1]
It might also be an idea to Open up a *second* (non-Full Screen or
Maximised) Browser Window, (at the same time, on the Screen) of the
Same Image, but this time have it *not* Set to Automatically
ReSize/Zoom the Image.
Scroll it to the bottom Right Corner (where the 3 Squares of the
White - Grey, Grey to Black & White to Black Gradients are) & include
that second Window in the Screen Dump as well?

Or just do another ScreenDump of it, cos on a typical LCD Screen
of only 1280 x 1024 Pixels, there's not really enough room to have
them both showing together.

Anita Carter...

My grandson is full of praise for their after sales service - when he had
probs with his pc - the salesman rang him back and spent over 2 hours with
him talking him through until they had it all sorted out.